Friday, March 7, 2014

Six reasons to believe in God?

Here we have an article that claims to present six 'straightforward' reasons to believe that there is a God. Here's how they describe their own list...
Just once wouldn't you love for someone to simply show you the evidence for God's existence? No arm-twisting. No statements of, "You just have to believe." Well, here is an
Deny Ra, and you'll regret it!
artwork by GENZOMAN
attempt to candidly offer some of the reasons which suggest that God exists.
Believe me, I'm going to hold you to your presented standard, Marilyn Adamson.

And as soon as she says that she starts the dishonesty right of the bat.
But first consider this. When it comes to the possibility of God's existence, the Bible says that there are people who have seen sufficient evidence, but they have suppressed the truth about God. On the other hand, for those who want to know God if he is there, he says, "You will seek me and find me; when you seek me with all your heart, I will be found by you." Before you look at the facts surrounding God's existence, ask yourself, If God does exist, would I want to know him? Here then, are some reasons to consider...
Right... And Christians are just suppressing the evidence for Ra, Odin, and Vishnu. Sorry, but you can't just invent a defense that automatically defines anyone who disagrees as willfully incorrect. I could say that you really do know that Thor exists, you just choose to deny his power and might. As for knowing God, or wanting to... Wanting to know God and his word better actually ended up making me an atheist. If there is a God, I certainly still want to know though. So, on to the six reasons...
1. Does God exist? The complexity of our planet points to a deliberate Designer who not only created our universe, but sustains it today.
Um... actually no, it didn't. The universe abides by constant laws of nature. Complexity can be explained by these laws, the sheer passage of great expanses off time, and the great numbers at play.

The Earth is offered as an example. It is said that Earth is the right size and in the right location for life. The only such planet we know of. They ignore that evidence is showing more and more that Mars once had all the conditions for life, and may have once hosted it. They also claim that Earth is in such a perfect position that were it any closer to the Sun, it would burn up, and and further away, it would freeze. This is false. There is a habitable zone that Earth orbits in, but Earth does not reside in some inch-perfect orbit with no room for variation. If it did, Then one side of the Earth would be too hot, and the other too cold since the Earth is 12,742km wide. Also, the orbit of the Earth varies by 4,999,942km. That is not a trivial amount of variation at all.

The fact that Earth is pretty good at supporting life doesn't mean that it had to be designed expressly for life. When you consider that there are billions of stars in every galaxy, each one possibly hosing planets, and there are billions of those galaxies, that means there are a LOT of planets out there. Conditions on each will likely be a little different. So is it so hard to believe that given so many
possible planets, at least one had the right recipe for life as we know it? The conditions for life aren't here because we are here. Rather, we're here, because the right conditions were.

Water is another example offered. Yet their claims are easily explained by chemistry and biology. The brain and eye are also claimed proof of design. Two amazing organs that are beautiful results of evolution. They claim that evolution can not explain either, but they would be wrong. For example... With the eye, we know of many intermediate forms of eyes. All the way from a simple patch of light sensitive cells to the complex eyes found in humans and other animals.

But the eye is a very poor example for design. Yes, it is amazing. But the newest engineer could easily improve on it. If the human eye was designed, why do some animals have so much better eyesight than us? Also, when you consider the entire spectrum, our eyes can only see a small sliver. There are insects that can even see what we can't. But as for the human eye, if it was designed, it was done poorly. Part of our eye is 'built' upside-down and backwards, and our eyes also have a blind spot. Is it reasonable to claim that the human eye was divinely designed when a digital camera has a better 'eye'?
2. Does God exist? The universe had a start - what caused it?
The Big Bang, because... Evidence! Oh, of course they follow up by stating that it is not known where what went 'bang' came from. An odd thing to point out, since God don't explain things any better, for you then have to explain where God came from. They may claim that God just always existed. But why couldn't energy have always existed? If you ask me, it's far more likely that something simple like energy always existed, rather than an infinitely complex deity, if something had to always exist. In fact, a creator god would violate have to contain more energy than the universe itself in order to create the universe. So you tell me... what's more likely to 'just be'... static electricity or a machine made to create that electricity?
3. Does God exist? The universe operates by uniform laws of nature. Why does it?
Actually, the fact that there are natural unchanging laws suggests a naturally occurring universe. In a created universe, the laws of nature could be turned on or off or tweaked to the designer's whims. A universe where gravity is different from day to day would be what would throw a wrench into the view of a natural universe. If it was all created, God could simply choose to 'turn off' gravity for a moment to show his might. Or he could dial the laws of nature to different settings on other planets so that they would be able to support life after all. Instead, what we see is a natural universe that follows natural laws.
4. Does God exist? The DNA code informs, programs a cell's behavior.
True, DNA is amazing.But it's also a product of complex bio-chemistry. It is sometimes called a code or a language. But that terminology is more of a way to explain what DNA does. It's not a code in the sense that it was created and handed to the cells with an instruction booklet. But it is a code in the sense that the combination of chemical sequences result in different traits, etc.

But while DNA is wonderful, and can allow the passing on of good traits, it can also result in the passing on of negative ones. Perhaps the inheriting of hemophilia. It can even result in other results... say, Down's Syndrome. And DNA isn't even as good as it gets. Consider GNA for a moment. It does not exist in nature, but can be created in the lab. Yet GNA is more stable than DNA. If the 'coding' of life were intelligently created, why go with DNA instead? Not being natural wouldn't be a hurdle for a god to worry about.  Instead, it's far more likely that DNA followed RNA, and other chemical combinations came before them. Remember, when we get right down to it we're only talking about chemicals finding themselves in the right mix and the right environment.
5. Does God exist? We know God exists because he pursues us. He is constantly initiating and seeking for us to come to him.
Come again? An unsubstantiated claim is not even close to an explanation or a good reason to believe. Maybe Thor is constantly seeking to be known. He does have his very own day of the week, and perhaps every thunderstorm is a sign that he is there after all.

Marilyn claims that atheists worry about God and study religion because God is pursuing us. If that was the case, I find it odd that an all-knowing God would choose not to provide any evidence at all that would change my mind. I mean, I'm not looking for much. Yet the simplest of tasks must be too much for this god.

Atheists talk about God and study religion for all kinds of reasons. We want to fight the harm it is doing in the world. We want to point out when religion is unfairly striping people of their rights. We point out how hateful and violent supposedly peaceful or loving can be. We want to stop religion from getting in the way of progress, or religion denying things we now know to be truths. And in the USA, we fight those who try to illegally shoehorn religion into our secular government.

And if God is pressuring everyone would doesn't believe in him, why is it that Hindus, Buddhists, Native Americans, Inuits, or those that believe in tribal religions don't examine and study Christianity? If God is trying to stalk me into belief, then he should be doing the same to them. But they aren't studying anything other than their own religion. Seems God also forgot to try and convince a ton of people.

Furthermore, I not only study and show interest in Christianity, but many other religions as well. Is my thinking the Norse religion is also false, the fact that I'd defy the Norse religion becoming law, and the opinion that adherents to the Norse myths are delusional mean that what is actually happening is that Odin is reaching out to me? Sorry, but this argument doesn't wash in several ways and is pretty close to doing what the author said she wouldn't do right at the beginning. Saying God is actually trying to reach me and offering no actual proof is pretty close to 'you're just going to have to believe me on this'.
6. Does God exist? Unlike any other revelation of God, Jesus Christ is the clearest, most specific picture of God revealing himself to us.
Um... How? "Jesus claimed to be God"... Oh for crying out loud! Is that really the best you've got? Yes, the Bible says that Jesus claimed to be equal to God. But Thor claimed to be a god in his own right, as well as the son of the all father, the god Odin. I can write a book right now saying that I am equal to God. Does that make it true? Of course not.

Also, how can anyone say which theology is the 'clearest' picture of God, when we don't even know that he exists. If there is a God, and we don't know which one, we also don't know his traits. To claim the Bible is the clearest picture is to rely only on personal preference. It could just as easily be that the Egyptians were the ones that got it right, or maybe the Greeks. Or maybe they all have it wrong. But when you have nothing to compare all the stories to, you can't claim one to be more accurate that the rest.

So in the end we are left with six VERY weak 'reasons' to believe in God. None of them being reasonable, and either relying on fallacies, ignorance, or personal preference. And that's the great thing about the truth, it's true whether we believe it to be true or not. So keep on believing this list is anything other than laughable, and I'll continue see see it as the utterly worthless and oft refuted list that it actually is.


-Brain Hulk

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11 comments:

  1. we all know that mass energy that "created big band" is not eternal... actually no energy is eternal , blowing stars are just proof of it, so if there is God, he could be eternal, but energy cannot - proven fact. So since now we know that energy is NOT eternal, how do you explain the big bang im asking you ? what caused him ? and if we are not created here, means that ANY planet with life supporting conditions has life on it... for real ? how many trillions stars in universe, how many possibilities for evolution, yet we NEVER saw some flying spaceship of more advanced race that evolved somewhere else with our bellowed Hubble... Universe suposed to be how much old ? Pretty enough time for some evolving inhabitants from other planets to build some badass space ship and fly... or to learn how to manipulate dark energy or something to travel from system to system in matter of time. yet NOTHING of that happened... Also don't forget some NON CHRISTIAN documents that report Jesus's existence back in time of rome empire and those rulers in some scripts. Since we ALL started evolving from same matter, how comes that we humans are SO advanced "God-Like" creatures and no animal could EVER compete to our creativity, intelligence etc etc....

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    1. "we all know that mass energy that "created big band" is not eternal... actually no energy is eternal , blowing stars are just proof of it, so if there is God, he could be eternal, but energy cannot - proven fact."

      If you actually read what I said, I said that it is far more likely to me that something like energy always existed, than an infinitely complex being always existing (assuming anything always existed). Also law of conservation of energy states that energy can not be created or destroyed, but may transition from one form to another. So yes, I feel that this law coupled with the likelihood of simple energy vs infinitely complex deity 'just being' makes the case for energy being the odds on favorite if something has to be eternal.

      "So since now we know that energy is NOT eternal, how do you explain the big bang im asking you ?"

      Actually, I just showed that energy could possibly be eternal... Even ignoring that, the Big Bang is not threatened if we don't know where that energy came from. It's about the expansion. What came/happened before the Big Bang is another question entirely.

      "what caused him ?"

      Yes, what caused your god? Or did you mean to ask something else?

      "and if we are not created here, means that ANY planet with life supporting conditions has life on it... for real ?"

      No, not every planet with the right conditions DOES... It's that any planet with the right conditions COULD. That's a huge difference. Heck, the possibility still exists that Mars does, or did, support life. It may only be microbial. But it would still be life. Mars was once a lot like earth, and would have cooled faster after it formed. It even still has water, so the possibility is very real.

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    2. "how many trillions stars in universe, how many possibilities for evolution, yet we NEVER saw some flying spaceship of more advanced race that evolved somewhere else with our bellowed Hubble... Universe suposed to be how much old ? Pretty enough time for some evolving inhabitants from other planets to build some badass space ship and fly... or to learn how to manipulate dark energy or something to travel from system to system in matter of time. yet NOTHING of that happened... "

      You do realize that space is huge right? It could be that the closest planet that has/had life is just too far away. It could be that they have lived and gone extinct. They could have no idea that we're here. Or they may be like us in the fact that they are also wondering if they are alone, and have similar space flight capabilities as us. Just because we haven't been visited, or seen an extraterrestrial UFO doesn't mean there's no life out there. Even if there was a planet that was a wet globe that is only inhabited with fish-like creatures, that would be huge. I think the problem is that you are setting what you expect we should see far too high.

      "Also don't forget some NON CHRISTIAN documents that report Jesus's existence back in time of rome empire and those rulers in some scripts."

      Like? I often hear this claimed, but no one can ever provide any when asked. So please, provide the historically contemporaneous documents that confirm both that Jesus existed and was who he was supposed to be.

      "Since we ALL started evolving from same matter, how comes that we humans are SO advanced "God-Like" creatures and no animal could EVER compete to our creativity, intelligence etc etc...."

      Creatures evolve to best fit their environments. Even the slightest understanding of evolution would make it clear that we should see all types of different forms that are specialized in different ways. We like to think we are the pinnacle, yes we don't have the best vision, don't have the best hearing, don't have the best sense of smell, don't have the best ratio of strength, we aren't the fastest on land, or in water. We can't fly, we can't walk up walls, and we aren't the only social, intelligent, creative, or tool using creatures. We are a good mix that has positioned us in a very advantageous position overall. But we are far from "god-like".






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    3. "Like? I often hear this claimed, but no one can ever provide any when asked. So please, provide the historically contemporaneous documents that confirm both that Jesus existed and was who he was supposed to be.
      "
      You have that on YT, in some old scipts ofc by rome empire folks, I watched it ONLY once and forgot to bookmark it for stubborn (and lazy) folks like yourself... Do your homework and find it.
      "Creatures evolve to best fit their environments" FASLE excuse, BOTH we and cats evolved in same conditions , yet they are not even close to us... Why animals don't have creativity ? Strive for discoveries ? Because they did not evolved at all... Some species went extinct, yet they didn't evolved to save themselves, proof there is no such a thing as evolution. Also, how comes when we do something bad we feel guilt ? Because we know its wrong from the god itself, we got the law saying its bad (10 commandments)... Else it wouldn't be a bad thing to nail 10 (free) chicks per night. if there isn't the devil, you wouldn't feel jealousy if someone nails your wife... I mean cmon, its not a soap, so he wont waste her in one "use" ... Emotions are best proof of Gods existence.

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    4. Also lets not forget that biblical prophecies 3000-2000 years ago are actually fulfilling today and are fulfilled in the past. That's NOT a coincidence. Wonder which prophecies ? Google for them.

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    5. just a hint: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnhcZ5sK9tU

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    6. "just a hint: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnhcZ5sK9tU"

      That video is just laughable. They are all either incredibly vague, self fulfilling, man actively tried to fulfill it, so obvious that anyone could have seen it coming, are no more amazing that any book's sequel carrying forward continuity, or are claims that all religions can and do make. The only way some of these even fit is if you desperately twist them to try and make them fit. Not to mention it even lists prophecies that weren't fulfilled for some reason, and also includes outright false statements...

      You really want to rely on a video that calls the moon landing (among other things) a hoax, doesn't even realize that Tyre still exists to this day, promotes chem-trails, and actually claims there is irrefutable proof that Noah's flood occurred?

      "You have that on YT, in some old scipts ofc by rome empire folks, I watched it ONLY once and forgot to bookmark it for stubborn (and lazy) folks like yourself... Do your homework and find it."

      Believe me, I'm not lazy. I have done my research... Far more research than you if you you eat up that woeful video. I believe I have seen what you are referring to, and the simple fact is that it isn't first person contemporaneous confirmed proof of a Jesus that was actually the son of a god.

      "FASLE excuse, BOTH we and cats evolved in same conditions , yet they are not even close to us"

      That's not even close to true. With a statement like that I would think you were trying to troll me if I didn't know better. Early hominids and early cats had very different needs in, and experienced very different pressures. Different diets, different predators and prey, different living conditions, and the differences in their biology.

      "Why animals don't have creativity ?"

      They do. Some animals use tools and create art.

      "Strive for discoveries ?"

      All sort of animals do. I can watch my cats explore all the time.

      "Because they did not evolved at all..."

      The entire fossil record and DNA evidence says otherwise.

      "Some species went extinct, yet they didn't evolved to save themselves, proof there is no such a thing as evolution."

      No, that's proof that you have no idea what evolution is or how it works. Extinction is just one of the mechanisms the evolution works by.

      "Also, how comes when we do something bad we feel guilt ?"

      Because of morals, which can and does occur naturally. The big one is empathy. But what about the fact that other animals also seem to feel guilt as well?

      "Because we know its wrong from the god itself, we got the law saying its bad"

      The same God that commanded the smashing of innocent babies and allows taking of rape slaves?

      "if there isn't the devil, you wouldn't feel jealousy if someone nails your wife..."

      Seriously? You obviously don't know much about the evolution of social creatures that agree to form paired couples. Also, what about other animals that display jealousy?

      "Emotions are best proof of Gods existence."

      Actually, no they aren't. Would you believe a Buddhist that
      claimed that emotions are the best proof of the Buddha's existence? You can't simply state something without any proof.

      "Also lets not forget that biblical prophecies 3000-2000 years ago are actually fulfilling today and are fulfilled in the past. That's NOT a coincidence."

      And what about the prophesies that were supposed to have been fulfilled that weren't?

      If this is the best you have, then sadly you've not shown me anything that hasn't been shown to me before. Just the same non-proof that has been paraded around and around with no attempt to actually innovate or prove anything with any degree of testable accuracy.

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    7. You do realize that you cant compare Buddhism to Christianity, because when u take into consideration: age (how old actual religion is) , number of followers, AND proofs found do back up each of the case (example of proof about Mosses crossing the red sea and pharaohs golden wheel found on same calculated location, but that's just 1 of many proofs), another proof is historical date described in bible when Israel was enslaved by Egypt, they found on some excavation sites in Egypt with pieces of Israel's culture, and buildings overall, which are matching the date of Israel slavery described in bible...
      Another proof about prophesy of Israel reunion: http://www.end-times-bible-prophecy.com/prophecy-fulfilled-israel-becomes-a-nation-in-1948.html
      Another prophecy about Egypt never ruling over another nation after they enslaved Israel back in days: 7. Egypt would never again rule over other nations
      Bible passage: Ezekiel 29:15
      Written: between 593-571 BC
      Fulfilled: 1967, etc.
      In Ezekiel 29:15, the prophet says that Egypt would recover from a desolation (perhaps Babylon's attack about 2600 years ago), but that it would never again rule over other nations. Up until the time of Ezekiel, Egypt had been a world power for centuries, dominating many nations, including Israel. But for most of the past 2500 years, Egypt has been controlled by foreign powers, including the Romans, Ottomans and Europeans. Today, Egypt is an independent nation again. In 1948, 1967 and 1973, Egypt tried to dominate Israel but was unsuccessful each time, despite the fact that Egypt is 10 times larger than Israel.Since the time of Ezekiel, Egypt no longer rules over other nations.
      Here is Ezekiel 29:15
      "It will be the lowliest of kingdoms and will never again exalt itself above the other nations. I will make it so weak that it will never again rule over the nations."

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    8. Again Isaiah foretold of the worldwide return of Jews to Israel.
      Bible passage: Isaiah 43:5-6
      Written: perhaps between 701-681 BC
      Fulfilled: late 1900s
      In Isaiah 43:5-6, the prophet Isaiah said that the Jews would return to their homeland from the east, the west, the north and the south. Isaiah lived about 2700 years ago. At that time, the Assyrians had forced many Jews in the northern kingdom of Israel into exile. Those Jews were taken to other areas in the Middle East. Then, about 1900 years ago, the Romans destroyed the city of Jerusalem and killed and exiled hundreds of thousands of Jews. Since then, the Jews have been scattered to virtually every country in the world. But, during the past century, millions of Jews have returned to Israel, from the east, the west, the north and the south.
      From the east: Many Jews living in the Middle East moved to Israel by the early 1900s.
      From the west: During mid-1900s, hundreds of thousands of Jews living in the West (Europe and the United States) began moving to Israel.
      From the north: The former Soviet Union (Russia) is north of Israel. It refused to allow its Jewish residents to move to Israel. But, after years of pressure from other countries, Russia finally began to allow Jews to return to Israel during the 1980s. So far, hundreds of thousands of Russian Jews have moved to Israel.
      From the south: Ethiopia, which is south of Israel, also refused to allow its Jews to return to Israel. But, in 1985, Israel struck a deal with Ethiopia's communist government to allow the Jews of Ethiopia to move to Israel. On the weekend of May 25, 1991, 14,500 Ethiopian Jews were airlifted to Israel.
      Isaiah's prophecy was also correct in saying that the north (Russia) and the south (Ethiopia) would have to be persuaded to give up their Jews. Many countries pressured Russia for years before it began to allow its Jews to leave. And Ethiopia had to be paid a ransom to allow its Jews to leave.
      Isaiah's prophecy was also correct in saying that the Jews would return "from the ends of the earth," and Isaiah said that many centuries before the Jews had been scattered to the ends of the earth. During the past 100 years, Jews living as far east as China, as far west as the West Coast of the United States, as far north as Scandinavia, and as far south as South Africa, have moved to Israel.
      Here is Isaiah 43:5-6
      "Do not be afraid, for I am with you; I will bring your children from the east and gather you from the west. I will say to the north, `Give them up!' and to the south, `Do not hold them back.' Bring my sons from afar and my daughters from the ends of the earth...."

      There are many more fulfilled prophecies, some of them mentioned in video I provided (in which u cant debunk a single statement) and I could do this all day long (point them out), but unfortunately I have real life commitments which are more Important that arguing with person who believes we evolved from monkeys "aka common ancestors" lol.
      "And what about the prophesies that were supposed to have been fulfilled that weren't?
      " there is not a single prophecy that should be fulfilled by now and its not, there are only fulfilled and those yet to be... By the way, prophecies are fulfilled in STAGES, so you cant expect them all to be fulfilled at once...

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    9. My last comment here (after this, ill un-bookmark this page and prolly forget I ever visited it): If there is no God, you have NOTHING to loose, but IF there is one (and judging by more prophesies that are yet to be fulfilled) you have to loose A LOT, see, I for the body and what other thinks of me being religious don't care, but for the soul, which is eternal, damn right I will care... Following Jesus, I know (in case there is God), I have NOTHING to loose, only to gain after death, so its a win-win situation for me (if there is no God, I still didn't lost nothing, maybe some time on writing this, but who cares)... For you, its either win or loose on EPIC proportion if other side turns out to be right. And since NO HUMAN returned from heaven to witness if there is hell or not, I wouldn't bet my soul just on a chance that there MIGHT or MIGHT NOT be a God... After all, faith (believing) doesn't cost nothing. Farewell.

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    10. Re: Age of Christianity and number of followers: So since Hinduism is older than all Abrahamic religions it is more true than Christianity by your 'logic'. Hinduism also has many scores of followers. But age and number of followers prove nothing. Without proof that Jesus was the literal magical son of God, it is no more than an unfounded claim. And there is no proof of that.

      Re Red Sea: The problem is that there is no such evidence. If you bothered with even a brief search you would have seem that the chariot 'discoveries' is no more than a widely perpetuated hoax.

      Re Egypt Slaves: Except that there isn't any actual archaeological evidence that the Jews were ever slaves in Egypt. In fact the Merneptah inscription is the earliest (and only) mention if Israelites, and it only references the Israelites of Canaan.

      Re Israel becoming a nation: Again, you should dig a bit more. There are even other sects of Christianity that say that what you are saying is false...

      Re Egypt: But Egypt has one of the strongest militaries in the region (No. 6), and it's economy is ranked No. 11 in the region. They aren't #1, but they are far from last, and are light years ahead of some if you count the entire continent. Sure, Egypt is no longer THE world power, but no nation ever stays #1 forever, so that is hardly surprising.

      Re the video you posted last time: I did comment on it. More general comments rather than point-by-point (although I did mention a few specifically). But that was due to lack of time and just how terrible that video and it's 'proofs' were. Maybe you need to re-read what I wrote, but to anyone that is viewing it that is being honest, does even slight research, and hasn't decided it was all true before watching it, that video is a poor poor example and devoid of the proof that you claim it contains. I could show you why each fails point-by-point, but why should I waste my time pointing out facts to someone who isn't interested in facts?

      Re Evolved from monkeys: Actually I don't believe we 'evolved for monkeys'. I recognize the truth of evolution, but your phrasing proves that you don't even understand the basics of it.

      Re Commitments: Guess what, I have real world commitments too. But you haven't shown any interest in even considering you could be wrong. I realize I could be wrong about the Bible and God, and would love proof if there is any. But I'm still waiting. But you aren't interested in honestly questioning your beliefs. So you'll have to give me a reason to invest that kind of time.

      Re Unfulfilled: Jesus didn't return in his follower's lifetime, Tyre wasn't destroyed forever, Jews not numerous as the stars... Want me to continue. What about ones that can't be fulfilled, like the stars falling literally to Earth?

      Re Pascal's wager: Sorry but Pascal's wager is a terrible argument. I even wrote a whole blog on it here: http://brainhulklogicsmash.blogspot.com/2013/07/pascals-wager-safe-bet.html

      I bid you farewell as well. You do indeed like to talk a big game, alas you were void of the substance you claimed to posses. I crave proof and you failed to deliver any. I know you think you did, but that just exposes how deep you bias and close-mindedness runs.

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